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Italian Floor Corker + Synthetic Corks


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#1 lodestone

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 08:31 AM

I've recently bottled my first 150 bottles, using an italian floor corker, and synthetic corks, some of which were Nomacorc longs, and some shorter corks, I'm not sure who made them but i got them from a reputable source- AustinHomeBrew-.

While putting labels on, two of them leaked. I noticed that as I inspected the cork through the neck of the bottles, there is a crease in the cork.
They all have this crease, although only a couple leak.

I ran my finger inside the iris of the corker and I don't feel any burrs. I recorked the two leakers, and they leak again. I'm wondering if those two leakers are bad bottles.

Anyway, I can live with 2 leakers out of 150 bottles, I'll just drink those first.

I think the outer layer of the sythetic is folding instead of compressing.

What are your thoughts, do I have a problem that I should be figuring out how to correct?

I want to use synthetic because it will work much better in my particular storage arrangement if I can store upright.

Thanks,

Dan

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#2 basshle

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 08:47 AM

I don't have an answer for you on this one. But I also have a problem with synthetic corks in my portugese floor corker. Whenever I use synthetic corks, about 1/2 of the inserted corks will have a little lip turned up at the bottom of the cork. Almost as if the bottle is not centered under the cork as it is inserted. I have checked the adjustment for bottle centering and everything is fine. It never happens with natural cork, and thankfully I have had no leakers yet. But this is a pesky problem that I would like to resolve so that I can use the synthetics with a little more confidence. I half wonder if the stiffness of the covering on the synthetics is allowing it to catch on imperfections in the neck of the bottle? I hope that someone can help both of us on these issues.

Todd

#3 Borisbbadd

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 09:13 AM

QUOTE (lodestone @ Feb 24 2005, 08:03 AM)
I ran my finger inside the iris of the corker and I don't feel any burrs.

Thats what would have been my first thought.
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#4 drew22to375

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 11:08 AM

I don't have that problem with my Italian. Of course I have only done about 30 normacorcs so far. Some on here mentioned awhile back about taking a permament marker and making a circle around the cork then running the cork thru the iris. This will alow to to find out what part of the iris is causing the crease.

Drew..

#5 Seb

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 11:48 AM

I have corked probably over 5000 bottles with my Italian corker over the years . Since last year I only use Nomacork ( this is the manufacturer by the way ). Few months ago I notice the small crease line on some bottles ( without any leakers however ). To find the source of the problem I cork without a bottle and while adding the pressure on the lever I was looking underneath to see what was causing the creasing line. I slightly sand the place where the mark was created and now everything is ok again. I had corked more than 500 Nomacork recently without a problem. But if you observ the outside material of the Nomacork to fold it is because you don't use the chamfered model. The non-chamfered are for commercial bottling device. With the chamfered Nomacork you will avoid the folding of the outside material of the cork.
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#6 c_fusion

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 12:25 PM

QUOTE (lodestone @ Feb 24 2005, 10:03 AM)
What are your thoughts, do I have a problem that I should be figuring out how to correct?

I had already been warned by one of my suppliers (grapeandgranary) that brass jawed corkers will score the sides of this type cork and cause wine to leak down the score mark.

They say that: It does not happen all the time, but enough for us to warn people about it.

So, now, I just use the Altec or Guardian which are the best for long term storage.
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#7 Cajun

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 01:23 PM

Todd, I was having this problem with the synthetic corks having the turned up lip. I have a Portuguese Floor Corker and use Neocork Synhetic corks.I corrected the problem by making a new adjustment plate for the bottom of the corker. The factory one just did not line up the neck of the bottle correctly. Also, I find that you get better results if you do not drop the cork into the jaws, but slide it into the jaws until the top of the cork is flush with the top. You will have to keep a slight bit of pressure on the jaw to keep the cork from droping all the way to the bottom. Then continue to insert the cork. I only have a few corks with turned up lips and they are only on the bottles with the flared tops. Also, I just dip each cork in water before inserting. Hope this helps James

#8 Seb

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 01:45 PM

QUOTE (c_fusion @ Feb 24 2005, 12:57 PM)
I had already been warned by one of my suppliers (grapeandgranary) that brass jawed corkers will score the sides of this type cork and cause wine to leak down the score mark.

So, now, I just use the Altec or Guardian which are the best for long term storage.

Here is a guideline for bottling with Nomacorc. http://excelcorc.com...tlingguide.html

As you can read there, the crease line is more related to plastic jaw than brass jaw so more with the portuguese than the Italian corker.


Also, I do not agree with you about Altec and Guardian being the best cork for long term storage. Altec use small particles glued together and because of this, there are good for 5-7 years max. Guardian are a synthetic closure and they are good for short term ageing of 2-3 years max. The best long term storage cork are high quality natural cork and Stelvin screw cap.
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#9 Seb

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 01:47 PM

QUOTE (Cajun @ Feb 24 2005, 01:55 PM)
Also, I just dip each cork in water before inserting. Hope this helps James

This is not a good idea. You should never dip or soak a synthetic cork before corking it. Every synthetic cork producer will tell you that.
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#10 Cajun

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 03:16 PM

Thanks for the advise on not dipping the synthetic corks in water. The good thing about this site is that you learn something each time you log on. James

#11 drew22to375

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 03:20 PM

QUOTE (Seb @ Feb 24 2005, 12:20 PM)
I had corked more than 500 Nomacork recently without a problem. But if you observ the outside material of the Nomacork to fold it is because you don't use the chamfered model. The non-chamfered are for commercial bottling device. With the chamfered Nomacork you will avoid the folding of the outside material of the cork.

Seb I've never seen Chamfered Normacorcs. Do you have to special order those from somewhere?

Drew..

#12 Seb

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 03:27 PM

QUOTE (drew22to375 @ Feb 24 2005, 03:52 PM)
Seb I've never seen Chamfered Normacorcs. Do you have to special order those from somewhere?

Ask your retailer, they should be able to order them. I talk with a tech guys from Excelcorc ( Nomacorc Canadian distributor ) and he said that home winemaking stores should NOT sell the regular cork but only the chamfered version. However, every place where I've seen the Nomacorc it is always un-chamfered. On the other hand, I saw the chamfered version in a wholesalers catalog here in Quebec so you should be able to find it. If you got some problem, refer to http://www.excelcorc.com/home.html and ask via email. This is how I got lots of technical information on Nomacorc. Maybe they will refer you to a US distributor but you should find out if you ask.
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#13 lodestone

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 04:14 PM

Seb, you're the man.

Merci

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#14 Brad B.

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 05:32 PM

I've also seen chamfered Nomacorks. They are specifically made for home winemakers and small commercial wineries using floor corkers. That said, I've only seen them at wholesalers--sorry I can't provide a supplier link for you.
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#15 Brad B.

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Posted 24 February 2005 - 05:34 PM

QUOTE (Seb @ Feb 24 2005, 02:19 PM)
This is not a good idea.  You should never dip or soak a synthetic cork before corking it.  Every synthetic cork producer will tell you that.

I've dipped Neocorks in Everclear before putting them in my floor corker. Works great--the alcohol kills anything on the cork or the corker, it helps the cork slide right in with minimal pressure (virtually eliminating the dimple on top), and the alcohol evaporates leaving a good seal.
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