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Cork Issues With Italian Floor Corker


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#1 touchtoomuch

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Posted 03 March 2008 - 09:08 PM

I am getting ready to bottle for the first time. I have read many posts on issues regarding synthetic corks and indentations on the corks causing them not to seal. Well, I purchased some normacorks, ld carlson first quality and twin disc corks. I ran one of the normacorks in a bottle that had wine in it. After a few minutes I put it on its side and it leaked right at the indentation that put the squeeze on the cork. I then pulled it out and put in a natural cork. It seemed to seal right away. So, out of curiousity I ran one of each of the corks through the floor corker without a bottle below it. i inspected all of the corks. I could feel the indentation on all three different types of corks. Has anyone else ran these tests? Any thoughts, ideas. I tried compressing the normacork for a few seconds before shoving it through. That didn't seem to help. I also tried doing it quickly. Will this cause sealing issues. I thought the italian floor corker was the god to bottling!!!! After ten minutes i still feel the ridges on all of the corks
Randy Dhom

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#2 touchtoomuch

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Posted 03 March 2008 - 10:30 PM

I also noticed on one of the normacorks that a couple of the indentions had a little cutting into the cork like a little paper cut on a finger.
Randy Dhom

Bulk Aging - 8 Gal Cranberry/Niagara, 7 Gal Cherry, 7 Gal Apple, 8 Gal Peach, 1.5 Gal Black Raspberry

Bottled - 3 Gal Persimmon,3 Gal Elderberry,6 Gal Exotic Fruits/White Zin(Kit), 6 Gal Dandelion, 6 Gal Blackberry, 3 Gal Cranberry/Concord, 6 Gallon of Gewurzt(Kit)

#3 homebrw311

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Posted 03 March 2008 - 11:42 PM

I had a similar problem when using synthetic corks with a floor corker - at least 30% leakers (same result with both the portugese and italian models). I switched to natural corks and haven't had a problem since. Maybe one or two leakers per batch, or none at all.

Others report no problem with the synthetics, so maybe it has something to do with the manufacturing variances in the corkers themselves.

Eric
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#4 cutter

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Posted 04 March 2008 - 07:30 AM

If you read the instructions that come with the wine kits, you will find that the recently corked bottles are to be left upright for 3-5 days before laying on thier sides. This allows the cork to expand and seal the bottle. If you use synthetic corks, you don't need to lay the bottles on teir sides since the synthetic corks won't dry out, if they're not in contact with the wine. Even the synthetic corks need time to expand and seal the bottles.
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#5 MartyYule

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Posted 04 March 2008 - 08:23 AM

I agree my cases are left upright for 48 hours before inverting. I don't use the fake corks however.

#6 touchtoomuch

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Posted 04 March 2008 - 09:33 AM

Well, I certainly agree about leaving them upright for a few days. however, that doesn't explain the cutting of the cork that the corker is doing... Thanks..
Randy Dhom

Bulk Aging - 8 Gal Cranberry/Niagara, 7 Gal Cherry, 7 Gal Apple, 8 Gal Peach, 1.5 Gal Black Raspberry

Bottled - 3 Gal Persimmon,3 Gal Elderberry,6 Gal Exotic Fruits/White Zin(Kit), 6 Gal Dandelion, 6 Gal Blackberry, 3 Gal Cranberry/Concord, 6 Gallon of Gewurzt(Kit)

#7 MartyYule

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Posted 04 March 2008 - 10:39 AM

QUOTE (touchtoomuch @ Mar 4 2008, 11:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, I certainly agree about leaving them upright for a few days. however, that doesn't explain the cutting of the cork that the corker is doing... Thanks..

Maybe the Jaws on your corker are not matched properly if it is cutting material. If it is relatively new why not return it if possible.

#8 cutter

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Posted 04 March 2008 - 10:45 AM

QUOTE (touchtoomuch @ Mar 4 2008, 10:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, I certainly agree about leaving them upright for a few days. however, that doesn't explain the cutting of the cork that the corker is doing... Thanks..


I found the following in an old thread discussing a similar issue. The thread was discussing grooves or lines cut into the cork.

"I too have a portugese model floor corker ,and I noticed that the cork was actually hitting the bottom plate , where the bottle lip is being held. I FILED IT AWAY A LITTLE AND WOW WHAT A DIFFERENCE !
Look down the iris while its closed and see how it lines up, top and bottom."

There were also comments in the thread about burrs and other flaws on the plate that nicked the corks. Hope this helps.
Juan

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#9 JoeD

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Posted 05 March 2008 - 12:30 PM

I use a Portugese and the only problems I had were on the Normacorks, (and the cheap cork ones I bought one time). I leave the bottles upright for 3 days and then age on their sides. The owner of the shop where I bought the synthetics said you don't need to lay the bottles on their sides but if wine leaks out when they are on their sides, won't air leak in if standing upright?
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#10 cutter

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Posted 05 March 2008 - 04:36 PM

QUOTE (JoeD @ Mar 5 2008, 01:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I use a Portugese and the only problems I had were on the Normacorks, (and the cheap cork ones I bought one time). I leave the bottles upright for 3 days and then age on their sides. The owner of the shop where I bought the synthetics said you don't need to lay the bottles on their sides but if wine leaks out when they are on their sides, won't air leak in if standing upright?


Since synthetic corks don't absorb any of the wine and won't dry out when not in contact with the wine, they either seal or they don't seal so it doesn't matter if they are layed down or stand upright. If they don't seal, you have problems. At least when they stand upright, you don't have a mess on the floor to clean up. It seems that Normacorcs and floor corckers don't play well together.
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#11 bmckee56

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Posted 05 March 2008 - 05:14 PM

QUOTE (cutter @ Mar 4 2008, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
"I too have a portugese model floor corker ,and I noticed that the cork was actually hitting the bottom plate , where the bottle lip is being held. I FILED IT AWAY A LITTLE AND WOW WHAT A DIFFERENCE !
Look down the iris while its closed and see how it lines up, top and bottom."

I have used the portugese model since the begining of my wine making over a year ago. I have recently noticed lipping of the cork once inserted into the bottle. It does not create any leakage that I am aware of, but it is something I do not like the looks of. What you mention above is something I will look closely at when I am in the cellar, working on my wines. I prefer to place the synthetic corks in a meta solution to sanitize prior to insertion into the bottle. I have tried them dry versus wet and both cause the lipping. Compressing the corks before inserting into the bottle does alliviate the problem a bit, but I would prefer not having to do it if possible. I have been patient long enough when it gets to bottling time and I believe the floor model should allow for a quick seating of the cork.

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#12 touchtoomuch

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Posted 06 March 2008 - 09:21 PM

I took a closer look at the jaws of this corker. It looks like one of the jaws has a gap in it when it is starting to compress. I was able to stick 5 layers of paper in behind the curve of the jaw. I am attaching a picture to see if anyone else thinks this is abnormal before I call and complain. It doesn't look like any of the other jaws have any gaps at the curves of the jaws.

Attached File  DSC01236.jpg   26.72K   128 downloads
Randy Dhom

Bulk Aging - 8 Gal Cranberry/Niagara, 7 Gal Cherry, 7 Gal Apple, 8 Gal Peach, 1.5 Gal Black Raspberry

Bottled - 3 Gal Persimmon,3 Gal Elderberry,6 Gal Exotic Fruits/White Zin(Kit), 6 Gal Dandelion, 6 Gal Blackberry, 3 Gal Cranberry/Concord, 6 Gallon of Gewurzt(Kit)

#13 MartyYule

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Posted 07 March 2008 - 06:07 AM

Mine do not look like that. there is no gap.

#14 bzac

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Posted 07 March 2008 - 08:17 AM

QUOTE (touchtoomuch @ Mar 6 2008, 10:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I took a closer look at the jaws of this corker. It looks like one of the jaws has a gap in it when it is starting to compress. I was able to stick 5 layers of paper in behind the curve of the jaw. I am attaching a picture to see if anyone else thinks this is abnormal before I call and complain. It doesn't look like any of the other jaws have any gaps at the curves of the jaws.

Attached File  DSC01236.jpg   26.72K   128 downloads


you can adjust the jaws on most floor corkers that one having brass jaws the jaws are even replaceable., place a bottle in the corker , get a wooden dowel that just fits inside a bottle , run the dowel down through the corker into the mouth of the bottle , open up the top of the corker , adjust the jaws so when compressed they are lined up with the dowel in the bottle , and also fully closed on the dowel.

Z

personaly I hate synthetic corks and never use them, just not worth the hassle (same with agglomerated crap) , premium real corks are the only way to go.
never once had a leaker in 14 years .
Above all relax , it's winemaking ,it's not supposed to be stressfull . It's not sky diving.

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#15 touchtoomuch

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Posted 09 March 2008 - 08:23 PM

BZAC,

How do you adjust the jaws?. As we all know, no instructions ever come with these dang things wallbash.gif ....... I am a little scared to start taking the screws out without asking someone about how to adjust first....
Randy Dhom

Bulk Aging - 8 Gal Cranberry/Niagara, 7 Gal Cherry, 7 Gal Apple, 8 Gal Peach, 1.5 Gal Black Raspberry

Bottled - 3 Gal Persimmon,3 Gal Elderberry,6 Gal Exotic Fruits/White Zin(Kit), 6 Gal Dandelion, 6 Gal Blackberry, 3 Gal Cranberry/Concord, 6 Gallon of Gewurzt(Kit)




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